Dark Forest hypothesis

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Pigeon
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Dark Forest hypothesis

Post by Pigeon » Sun Jul 30, 2023 11:59 pm

The dark forest hypothesis is the conjecture that many alien civilizations exist throughout the universe, but they are both silent and paranoid. In this framing, it is presumed that any space-faring civilization would view any other intelligent life as an inevitable threat, and thus destroy any nascent life that makes itself known. As a result, the electromagnetic spectrum would be relatively quiescent, without evidence of any intelligent alien life, as in a "dark forest" filled with "armed hunter(s) stalking through the trees like ghosts".

Background

There is no reliable or reproducible evidence that aliens have visited or attempted to contact Earth. No transmissions or evidence of intelligent extraterrestrial life have been detected or observed. This runs counter to the knowledge that the universe is filled with a very large number of planets, some of which likely hold conditions hospitable for life. Life typically expands until it fills all available niches. These contradictory facts form the basis for the Fermi paradox, of which the dark forest hypothesis is one proposed solution.

Relationship to other proposed Fermi paradox solutions

The dark forest hypothesis is distinct from the berserker hypothesis in that many alien civilizations would still exist if they kept silent. It can be viewed as a special example of the Berserker hypothesis, if the 'deadly berserker probes' are (due to resource scarcity) only sent to star systems that show signs of intelligent life.

Game theory

The dark forest hypothesis is a special case of the "sequential and incomplete information game" in game theory.

In game theory, a "sequential and incomplete information game" is one in which all players act in sequence, one after the other, and none are aware of all available information. In the case of this particular game, the only win condition is continued survival. An additional constraint in the special case of the "dark forest" is the scarcity of vital resources.[10] The "dark forest" can be considered an extensive-form game with each "player" possessing the following possible actions: destroy another civilization known to the player; broadcast and alert other civilizations of one's existence; or do nothing.

Science fiction versions

The hypothesis was described by astronomer and author David Brin in his 1983 summary of the arguments for and against the Fermi paradox, for which this hypothesis is one potential solution.[8][10] In 1987, science fiction author Greg Bear explored the concept in his novel The Forge of God. The term "dark forest hypothesis" was later applied to the idea in Liu Cixin's 2008 science fiction novel The Dark Forest.

In The Forge of God, humanity is likened to a baby crying in a hostile forest: "There once was an infant lost in the woods, crying its heart out, wondering why no one answered, drawing down the wolves."[17] One of the characters explains, "We've been sitting in our tree chirping like foolish birds for over a century now, wondering why no other birds answered. The galactic skies are full of hawks, that's why. Planetisms that don't know enough to keep quiet, get eaten.

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Pigeon
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Re: Dark Forest hypothesis

Post by Pigeon » Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:09 am

Berserker hypothesis

The berserker hypothesis, also known as the deadly probes scenario, is the idea that humans have not yet detected intelligent alien life in the universe because it has been systematically destroyed by a series of lethal Von Neumann probes. The hypothesis is named after the Berserker series of novels (1963-2005) written by Fred Saberhagen.

The hypothesis has no single known proposer, and instead is thought to have emerged over time in response to the Hart–Tipler conjecture, or the idea that an absence of detectable Von Neumann probes is contrapositive evidence that no intelligent life exists outside of the Sun's Solar System. According to the berserker hypothesis, an absence of such probes is not evidence of life's absence, since interstellar probes could "go berserk" and destroy other civilizations, before self-destructing.

In his 1983 paper "The Great Silence", astronomer David Brin summarized the frightening implications of the berserker hypothesis: it is entirely compatible with all the facts and logic of the Fermi paradox, but would mean that there exists no intelligent life left to be discovered. In the worst-case scenario, humanity has already alerted others to its existence, and is next in line to be destroyed.

Responses

A key component of the hypothesis is that Earth's solar system has not yet been visited by a berserker probe. In a 2013 analysis by Anders Sandberg and Stuart Armstrong at the Future of Humanity Institute at University of Oxford, they predicted that even a slowly replicated set of berserker probes, if it were able to destroy civilizations elsewhere, would also very likely have already encountered (and destroyed) humanity.
Relationship to other proposed Fermi paradox solutions

The dark forest hypothesis is distinct from the berserker hypothesis in that many alien civilizations would still exist if kept silent. The dark forest can be viewed as a special example of the berserker hypothesis, if the 'deadly berserker probes' are (due to resource scarcity) only sent to star systems which broadcast detectable signs of intelligent life.

The Great Filter hypothesis is a more general counterpart to the Berserker hypothesis, which posits that a great event or barrier prevents early-stage extraterrestrial life from developing into intelligent space-faring civilizations. In the Berserker hypothesis framing, the filter would exist between the industrial age and widespread space colonization.

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A von Neumann probe is a spacecraft capable of replicating itself.

It is a concatenation of two concepts: a Von Neumann universal constructor (self-replicating machine) and a probe (an instrument to explore or examine something).[citation needed] The concept is named after Hungarian American mathematician and physicist John von Neumann, who rigorously studied the concept of self-replicating machines that he called "Universal Assemblers" and which are often referred to as "von Neumann machines"
  • Probe: which would contain the actual probing instruments & goal-directed AI to guide the construct.
  • Life-support systems: mechanisms to repair and maintain the construct.
  • Factory: mechanisms to harvest resources & replicate itself.
  • Memory banks: store programs for all its components & information gained by the probe.
  • Engine: motor to move the probe.


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Re: Dark Forest hypothesis

Post by Pigeon » Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:22 am

Replicating seeder ships

Yet another variant on the idea of the self-replicating starship is that of the seeder ship. Such starships might store the genetic patterns of lifeforms from their home world, perhaps even of the species which created it. Upon finding a habitable exoplanet, or even one that might be terraformed, it would try to replicate such lifeforms – either from stored embryos or from stored information using molecular nanotechnology to build zygotes with varying genetic information from local raw materials.

Such ships might be terraforming vessels, preparing colony worlds for later colonization by other vessels, or – should they be programmed to recreate, raise, and educate individuals of the species that created it – self-replicating colonizers themselves. Seeder ships would be a suitable alternative to generation ships as a way to colonize worlds too distant to travel to in one lifetime.


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Royal
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Re: Dark Forest hypothesis

Post by Royal » Thu Aug 03, 2023 1:36 pm

Pigeon wrote: Mon Jul 31, 2023 12:22 am

Replicating seeder ships

Yet another variant on the idea of the self-replicating starship is that of the seeder ship. Such starships might store the genetic patterns of lifeforms from their home world, perhaps even of the species which created it. Upon finding a habitable exoplanet, or even one that might be terraformed, it would try to replicate such lifeforms – either from stored embryos or from stored information using molecular nanotechnology to build zygotes with varying genetic information from local raw materials.

Such ships might be terraforming vessels, preparing colony worlds for later colonization by other vessels, or – should they be programmed to recreate, raise, and educate individuals of the species that created it – self-replicating colonizers themselves. Seeder ships would be a suitable alternative to generation ships as a way to colonize worlds too distant to travel to in one lifetime.

This one possible, and the civ would need to hybridize with an existing lifeform on the planet to be compatible.

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Re: Dark Forest hypothesis

Post by Pigeon » Thu Aug 03, 2023 4:57 pm

Also might be bad news.

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Royal
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Re: Dark Forest hypothesis

Post by Royal » Thu Aug 03, 2023 7:03 pm

Pigeon wrote: Thu Aug 03, 2023 4:57 pm Also might be bad news.
From the looks of things it already happened.

But your fear is that we are building civilization for another race to come in and move in.

Nukes changed that game real quick, maybe thats why activity picked up in those locations.

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Re: Dark Forest hypothesis

Post by Pigeon » Thu Aug 03, 2023 8:42 pm

Maybe they have no use for humans.

I would not doubt there might be some connection with nukes here and their activity. Concern? Not polluting the planet they might use. Probably don't care about human deaths.

Given the cover up, either someone is greatly benefiting or no one really know anything about aliens and the future. But then there are those one or two alleged meetings. Bad news kept under wraps?

Seems obvious these are not diplomatic missions.

Part of the obvious USA playbook would be to use whatever for global superiority and guard it closely.

There is the possibility that advanced beings have no interest or reason to communication with humans.

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